Too little, too late and too much blood
Friday, November 18, 2011
 The second meeting with Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoğlu was tantamount to moral recognition of the Syrian National Council, says its member Khaled Khoja (R), speaking in his personal office in Istanbul. DAILY NEWS photos, Hasan ALTINIŞIK
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Q: What makes you say the Syrian National Council (SNC) represents nearly 80 percent of the Syrians, which is a very ambitious claim?
A: The gist of the SNC was actually a gathering of diaspora opposition who were seeking ways to support the demonstrators on the streets and had no claim to representation. But when the regime attempted to establish an alternative opposition group, the street forced the outside groups to assume responsibility. So we take our legitimacy from the street.
Q: What is the street? How can you judge their support from here?
A: There have been three consecutive Friday events when banners saying “SNC is our representative” were carried. There are three groups in Syria representing the streets and all three of them support us and have their representatives in the SNC, whose names are not disclosed obviously. The Muslim Brotherhood, Kurds and Christians also are represented in the SNC.
Q: The opposition meetings took place in Turkey. What was Turkey’s role during the whole process?
A: Actually Turkey did not really have a warm approach to the first congress in Istanbul.
Q: But even the fact that it let the congress happen is important.
A: But we did not ask for permission. Actually it was not really like a meeting of the opposition. It happened rather like a brain-storming by intellectuals. It was organized by Turkish NGOs. But opposition figures got to know each other in that meeting. When the regime sent a group to sabotage our meeting in Antalya, Turkish authorities said to them, go hold your own meeting in another hotel. They said this is a democratic country, people can hold meetings. It is then that we realized a change in attitude, and we said if we hold a congress the government won’t object.
Q: So Turkey was not behind this process.
A: No it was not at all. Its position was, “We neither say come here nor do we say go away.” But we also insisted for the meetings to take place in Turkey. Most of the participants have Syrian passports; there are no visa requirements for Syrians. We had visa problems with France, we tried but couldn’t organize it there. It is easy to come to Turkey from abroad. It is a secure country. At one stage there were discussions to go to Cairo. But some of our friends were attacked by Assad supporters in Cairo. We have easy access to media. Our friends from Paris were surprised as there were 20 cameras at our meeting. We need to be heard by the international media, which is present in Turkey. So there was not a better alternative.
Q: What now are your relations with Turkish government?
After the establishment of SNC we started to communicate at the level of Prime Ministry’s advisors and Turkey started to monitor the SNC. We then had our first meeting with Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoğlu. The second meeting was like a moral recognition. Turkey has been looking for a solution through persuasion with minimum loss of life. Turkey was never focused on military intervention. We know from the Libyan experience, Turkey never wants Muslims to kill other Muslims, it will never give weapons. We were also told so by the Libyans when we went there. They said: “Turkey helped us a lot, but it gave only financial help. It did not give one single bullet.” But Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan said Turkey would not stand silent if there are mass atrocities. The Arab League’s call for the protection of civilians is very important. So I believe Turkey will work for the implementation of sanctions. But if the regime continues to escalate violence, then I believe the next step will be a process leading to the establishment of a no-fly-zone and/or safe zones on the Turkish and Syrian border.
Q: So you believe Turkey will look to that positively?
A: The conditions of the Arab League are very clear. With the decision it took, the whole region has entered a very historic process. What is important from now on is to secure a consistent process.
Q: But how will this take place?
A: We are against military intervention, the type we have seen in Libya. What is very important are the streets in Syria. It is very important that they maintain their unity despite provocation from the regime. The NSC did not close its doors to anybody. We keep giving satisfactory messages to even the supporters of the regime. The regime stands on three pillars: the army, the Baath party and the regime’s financial supporters. Defections have started in the army. The people from the Baath party are waiting for another ship to come along to jump out from the ship they are on. Businessmen started to transfer their money from Syria. The regime is weakening from the inside and there will come a time it will just fall down with even a tiny push. It may take between six months and a year.
Q: But there are also important communities like minorities who continue to support the regime because they fear reprisals. There are fears of civil war.
A: But there have not been ethnic clashes since the beginning of the events. If there had been, for instance Sunnis attacking Nusayri villages, believe me the regime would have made them public. We also have Nusayri supporters. There have never been clashes between Muslims and Christians or between Nusayris and Sunnis.
Q: How about the massacres in Hama and Homs.
A: But they were not seen as sectarian clashes. They were seen as the regime’s effort to make the Nusayri part of these clashes so that the regime would share the same fate.
Q: How then will the transition process be if the regime falls?
A: Our red line is that we are against the revolution taking up arms. We are against ethnic civil war. When the regime falls, this will mean that the current regime of fear, based on the intelligence agency and the Assad family that controls it, will fall, while all other state officials will remain in their position. The SNC will abolish itself once the regime falls.
Q: Some fear radical Islamists and extreme Arab nationalists will replace the current regime.
A: This is being said for all Islamic countries. It was said of the Justice and Development Party (AKP). It was said after the revolution in Tunisia. Islamists movements became more pragmatic and less ideological. We saw this in the Turkish model. Islamic movements focused on providing services, not on ideology. It is their biggest success and other Islamic movements need to get adopted to the global culture and to the thoughts of younger generations.
Q: What is your evaluation of the Syrian Free Army?
A: These are soldiers who flee the army saying their mission is to protect civilians, not to kill them. But the clashes are mostly directed at those fleeing and them shooting back. But they cannot do much when their ammunition runs out. They stand more of a chance if there is a no-fly zone or safe zones. This will also increase the fleeing. But we do not advise the Syrian Free Army to launch attacks right now because it will complicate the situation and lead to internal conflicts.
Khaled Khoja was born in Damascus to a family with Turkish roots. He was interred in Syrian prisons in 1979 when his father provided financial support to the Muslim Brotherhood when uprisings started in Aleppo. He fled Syria in 1982 for Turkey, where he built a career as a doctor. Facing capital punishment, he has not returned to Syria since.
Following the sart of unrest in Syria in March, he became the head of the Turkey committee of the Damascus Declaration. The Damascus Declaration in 2005 was a historic statement of unity by opposition figures criticizing the regime as being authoritarian and calling for reform. Since then he has been participating in the meetings of the opposition groups, becoming a member of Syrian National Council.
Part 2
[youtube http://youtu.be/RDAhEbbOzOQ?]OBSERVER
I will try to imagine myself a small fly on the wall in the presidential palace.
Here is my analysis first
First, the discussion is centered on the fact that Syria accepted the Arab initiative with a short time strategy. It accepted the initiative to gain time and throw the opposition in disarray. Then it actually flipped the finger at the AL by continuing the violence and the repression and orchestrating mass demonstrations. It thought that this will give it all the time it needs. It did not count on the new facts on the ground:
1. The AL and every member state is facing a new reality called an active people educated and asking for participatory rule. Even KSA has used its massive wealth to buy yes buy loyalty from its citizens as it knows it no longer can use force. The people are fed up with one man rule with nepotism and corruption and graft and torture and yes slavery. This is the mentality of the regime in Syria and Libya. Either I rule you or I kill you. This is the mentality of the regime that is based I would say like the Zionist one on an exclusive place for the sect and the family in the world order.
2. The Qatari actually anticipated this very reaction and gave the regime a rope to hang itself with. The regime drunk with power was even more stoned after the UNSC vetoes and thought itself immune. Once the facts of non compliance become known and the inability of the regime to genuinely respond become obvious the AL under the GCC moved for the kill. The decision stems from the desire to deny legitimacy to the regime or at least its current method of control. It also stems from the fact that the Arab world is watching to see if any of these rulers are going to hijack the revolutions and keep the regimes in place.
3. The hysteria of the regime and its supporters is because the AL has effectively withdrawn legitimacy by suspending Syria’s representation; by offering a dialogue with the SNC; and by actually forcing the Coordinating committees in Cairo to commit to regime change. The local Coordinating Committees had requested regime change while leaving room for the current leadership to stay in place but the media exposure forced them to declare that the Security State in Syria is not acceptable and that they are not in dialogue with the regime itself.
4. Calling on the armed forces to resist orders is the most important item in this regard as it clearly says that these orders and therefore the people issuing the orders are not legitimate or legal.
5. Now that the AL has forced the issue, Russia is in a corner as it has always maintained that it is fostering a peaceful resolution and promoting dialogue without ever recognizing the legitimacy of the opposition. Now it will be forced to recognize the opposition as a valid and legitimate partner in this invitation to dialogue. In essence the stupidity of the regime has forced the hand of its supporters into recognizing the opposition. If the opposition cannot get its act together now then Syria is doomed.
6. There is clearly talk in Syria of arming the “people” and as Hajj Ali said this am on Aljazeera we will all wear army uniforms now; this talk is meant for the regime base and only the regime base. It is a desperate attempt to rally the troops as they are now fearful of defections within their own ranks.
7. Power delusion we witnessed with the Ghadafi clique as his sons just like Rami warned of dire consequences to the stability of Israel and the West, and we heard the Tooz on the AL from both Saif and the Syrian ambassador. This is emotional outburst that belies a complete misunderstanding of the change sweeping the region and of the balance of power in the region. Money talks and BS walks and B is going to walk. How soon and on which plank is the question now.
Now here is the imagination scene
B: What do I do now? 18 of the Arabths are after me and they are calling on the army not to follow my orderths. Pleathe Athma quiet the kidths I need to think. I have not done that in a while now.
A: crying silently and hugging the kids who are also crying because they cannot play while daddy is thinking.
M: In a rage destroying the furniture and ordering the killing of about 1000 detainees in Tadmur. Even his mother is avoiding him today.
R: Pulling his calculator and re calculating the prices and the creating an excel sheet of where the deposits are.
Now the serious work will be the privy of the old guard of the regime: these are absolutely ruthless thugs that may be plotting acts of revenge in various Arab countries and Turkey. The problem is that the AL is moving way too fast for their taste in this regard. When the AL head says that they are working on ways to protect the Syrian population, this means that the plan is moving forward and it has been thought through for some time. This the reason for the silence of the Turks as they coordinated with the AL and Qatar to see whether the regime is capable of reforms and whether the opposition can get its act together. Now we will see others helping the opposition form a legitimate alternative to the regime. Now they and others will have an Arab cover for intervention.
By the way there is a Dom Perignon bottle that we have kept since 1964 waiting to be uncorked I hope that we can celebrate soon.
ABOUD
I was talking with an American relative who lives on the West coast. She was crying and said she felt so much pain for us. I honestly don’t understand what she means.
I am so unbelievably blessed.
Yes, there are tanks in the streets, army checkpoints most places, shooting and tragedy. But I’m so much luckier than people far away, non Syrians who don’t have the same worries about their own homelands. Those people will finish studies, marry, have kids, live to a ripe old age….and never have done anything nearly as noble as win freedom for their country.
How so much fortunate we all are than our parents, who never got the chance to take on a despot. Without evil, there can be no good. Without darkness, no light. Without depraved villains, no heroes. We, all of us, have been blessed to be present at the exact place and time when our country is living through its most decisive days. What happens in Syria has already changed the Middle East, and will continue to do so for years to come.
Feel sorry for us? I wouldn’t miss this for anything in the world. Days like these come once every two generations. The last time the Middle East was disrupted in such a fashion was 1967. I don’t know about everyone else, but I’m not waiting 44 years for another chance to be part of incredible events.
Feel sorry for us? I pity people who will never have the chance to do anything remotely as extraordinary as what I’ve seen the people of Homs and Syria do, every single day for eight months.
Walls is the place where to be at; click here
Excellent articles and fantastic comments. I selected two about the above post but I could have taken all. Go and see for yourselves
I am astonished, in two ways: First, that the Regime in Damascus has so badly played its relations with the countries of the Arab League. Instead of using their collective brain-power to devise fresh strategies, they seem to have visited The Tomb in Qurdaha to receive instructions from the Plan, The Man, The Nation.
So sad and unpleasant to suspect that the Regime is in essence stuck with playbook written by the dead Lion. However much they leaf back and forth in the playbook, looking for the pages that tell them what to do … however much they search the Talking Trumpet points for new-sounding lines … however much they consult the Mafia donnas and dons who rule the Family Compact … however they search, there is no new Plan, just the old Plan. Crush, exterminate, lie, dominate, repress, jail, torture, disappear, harass, hunt, disparage, traitorize, condemn, corral and dispose into Tadmor’s welcoming embrace.
I am also astonished by the frenzied, near-hysterical reaction of the hardcore expat Regimist Kazoos. Their speech acts have today shifted from intensely, cultishly self-deluded into frankly insane and beyond (over at The Other Place, the menhebakji are topping each other with witless hysteria and impotent threats.
I am not as astonished by the Arab League vote itself.
It is as if the senior deluded maniacs at the Syrian Palace have no defense against reality but the shopworn dialects of SANA and State TV. The separation of their cognitive apparatus from dire reality is now a yawning gulf (I watched a solid hour of State TV earlier today — the entirety of the report was a non-stop yammer, Tell Us What We Must Hear ‘ordinary citizens’ recruited to repeat the demented script. Paranoid, deluded, hysterical, uninformed, frightened).
To those here who have approached Syrian issues with gravity, realism, heart and soul, and the utmost collegial intelligence, to our host OTW and to all the listed names above, my tankard is raised in salute.
It is my firm conviction that — finally — Syria is experiencing The Week That Was … although I have only one broken spiritual bone in my body, I utter an invocation: please bring peace and wisdom and freedom to Syria, before Assad runs it headlong into the ditch …
ABOUD
Did you see the regime rep’s press conference? They pretty much told the AL to go to hell. Do not underestimate the role personnel feelings play in the making of policy among the Arabs. Qaddafi had alienated everyone from here to Timbuktu, and no one lifted a finger to save him from himself.
Besho has now cornered himself into earning the same pariah status. There is only so much talk of “you are a tool of ze American-Zionist conspiracy against ze great prezident.” an Arab head of state will put up with, before retaliating.
While the GCC was the driving force, what clinched the deal was Egypt. As does Egypt, as goes the rest of the Arab world. The Egyptian people have noisily and overwhelmingly come out for their Syrian brethren. The Egyptian military council has enough on its plate without risking a backlash from an angry populace for the sake of Besho the Baffled.
In the end, the Arab League bowed to the inevitable. They would have had to take these steps sooner or later. In the age of Youtube and satellite channels, one can no longer ignore bloody atrocities, especially as they happen in a language everyone in the region understands.
Also, remember the very last sentence the Qatari FM said at the press conference. Syria is an important country, a vital one considering its position. The Qataris admit Syria is an important part of the “resistance”. They just don’t think junior is the man to lead it. A civil war in Syria would be disastrous for the region, and the regime’s atrocious behavior, and the astonishing, astounding, unprecedented resilience and tenacity of the Syrian people, was making that nightmare scenario a reality.
Now, two things will happen;
1) The opposition needs to grow up. The AL and the world are pleading with a credible opposition to take Besho’s place. The initiative and momentum is now with the SNC. It has been earned and bought with the lives and blood of a Syrian people *who refused to give up*. Now the SNC must make the most of it.
2) Pressure on Russia and China to reverse their positions. Arabiya’s correspondent in Moscow said that there are deep divisions within the Kremlin on Russia’s policy with regards to the regime. There is no doubt whatsoever that neither Russia nor China are prepared to alienate the Arab world for the sake of Besho. Can you imagine the hysteria of the menhebaks once a security council resolution goes against them?
We can all eliminate and dismiss even the remotest possibility that the regime will come up with a diplomatic coup to extract itself from this mess. They are incapable of speaking or dealing with anyone with anything other than thuggery. Trashing Arab and the Turkish embassy? Seriously Besho? How you manage to put on your trousers in the morning is one of the great mysteries of this revolution.
Read all of the comments at the in place here
Newsnight’s Shaimaa Khalil hears testimony in Lebanon from Syrians who have fled their country after protests which have reportedly left 1,100 people dead, hundreds more injured and thousands under arrest.
“You have to cover my face and change my voice otherwise they’ll know it’s me,” Kholood says.
“They have been watching us and they have my name on the wanted list for protesting.”
Kholood (not her real name) is a mother of four who, like thousands of other Syrian refugees, fled the border town of Talkalakh into the Wadi Khaled region in northern Lebanon after the Syrian army and security forces began their crack down on protesters.
Arida, the Lebanese village where Kholood and her family are now staying is only a stone’s throw away from the Syrian border.
You can see Syrian flags fluttering in the breeze and Syrian army personnel patrolling across the border – too close for the refugees’ comfort.
“When we saw what happened in Deraa, Banyas and Talbiseh, and how the people came out like they did we thought, ‘why not us? We should come out too!’ and we did and called for the fall of the regime.”
But the situation turned deadly when the Syrian security forces arrived in Talkalakh last month with tanks and armoured vehicles to crack down on protesters.
“There was non-stop shooting. When I looked out of the window I saw destruction all around. Glass everywhere. They had bulldozed some houses to the ground.”
Kholood continues: “That night we decided to flee. I crossed the bridge with my husband and youngest son.”
“We were all so scared. Some of the people that fled with us were shot on the way. Some were badly wounded and some died before reaching Wadi Khalid.”
Kholood was also fearful of being raped:
“I left Talkalakh to protect my honour. When we talk to our relatives in Banyas, Homs and Talbiseh they tell us horrifying stories. They told us that so many women were raped. These men don’t fear God.”
When I ask her about her three sons, aged 16 to 21 who chose to stay behind in Syria, Kholood bursts into tears.
“I’d be lying if I told you I didn’t want them here with me. I want to tell them to come here, but instead I tell them they should stay and be strong and fight.”
“They are my children. I love them, but we have to sacrifice if we want victory. This is much stronger than a mother’s love,” she cries.
When I ask if she hopes to one day return to Syria, Kholood looks at me defiantly.
“When the regime falls,” she says. “And it will fall, inshallah.”
“They gave us orders to fire heavily at unarmed civilians,” Qotayba al Akkari tells me.
“There was random shooting at people, no distinction between women, children, armed or unarmed men. Many, many were killed, many unarmed civilians.”
A Syrian army soldier, he fled to Lebanon and is now sitting among a group of Syrian activists.
“Our commanding officer would say: ‘There’s so much ammunition, no one is going to ask you where it went. Fire!'”
“I would fire in the air or at empty buildings because I knew that if they found out I wasn’t firing they’d detain me or kill me.”
“At first, I felt like I was having a nervous breakdown I was so surprised at all that was happening around me but after a while I got used to it and all the dead bodies.”
“Soldiers have no idea what goes on in Syria. They don’t allow us to watch any news channels except Syrian TV. They would accuse us of treachery if they caught us watching Al-Jazeera, Al-Arabiya or BBC.”
“There was also no contact between soldiers and their families, the mobile phone coverage was so bad. But even when the soldiers did manage to speak to their families, the families wouldn’t dare say that anything was wrong. The soldiers would ask ‘is everything ok?’ and the families would say ‘Yes, all fine.'”
Qotayba says that he now feels free, but that one day he will return to Syria, to fight with other soldiers who have defected.
“I’m not afraid anymore,” he tells me.
“Call me, Ibn Talkalakh,” the young textile shop owner tells me.
The name means ‘The son of Talkalakh’.
Ibn Talkalakh is also a Syrian activist who has recently come out of prison.
“When the people of Deraa moved I thought ‘that’s it!’ we have to do something.”
“It was very difficult in the beginning. People were scared. The tanks came and they started shooting everywhere and destroying homes. They were arresting people who went out to demonstrate and they came for me.”
“It was my brother and I in the house and from the moment they (the security forces) came in they did not stop beating us. They beat us with electric batons and tied our hands behind our backs and made us kneel in front of them, insulting us the whole time.”
“They blindfolded me and took to prison. They put me in a small cell. We were about 50 people in that cell, it was so crowded.”
Ibn Talkalkh was in prison for 20 days and says he was regularly beaten and tortured.
“Once they beat me so hard on the back of my head blood filled my eyes, I couldn’t see anything. When they interrogated me they would tie my wrists and leave me hanging for hours.”
He shows me the marks on his wrists.
“They put me in a room where I could hear others being tortured. I’d hear their screams, their pleas and it would fill me with fear.”
“I’ll never forget, during one interrogation, I was hanging with hands tied up and the interrogator came up to me and said: ‘Listen boy, it is Bashar al-Assad or no-one. We’ll never hand Syria over to you.'”
Yet despite the horrific time that Ibn Talkalakh had while in prison he tells me that he also found it inspiring.
“I met so many people with a much stronger will than mine. I met people from all walks of life – doctors, farmers, lawyers – many people who are willing to go out and take to the streets and keep asking for our rights even if it meant going to prison again.”
“It filled me with hope that justice will come and that this regime will fall. It made me more determined to come out and keep fighting.”
These interviews were conducted in Wadi Khaled on the Lebanon-Syria border on 16-17th June 2011. The BBC cannot verify the authenticity of these testimonies.
The courageous Syrian actress Fadwa Suleiman, who has led several anti-regime demonstrations in Homs, makes a videotaped plea to her fellow citizens. Below is a translation of the text of her speech:
“General strike Thursday in the city of Homs: Since yesterday, neighborhoods in Homs have been searched by the security forces looking for me. People were beaten to force them to reveal where I was. In case I am arrested by the security forces or the army, it is possible that I will be forced to appear on the Dunia TV station to confess that I am part of a conspiracy against Syria as they have done with the honorable hero, sheikh Ahmad Alsayasen and the (defected) army officer Hussein Harmoush. In case I or any one of my family are harmed in any way, I hold the regime, the army, the security forces and the shabiha (thugs) fully responsible. I declare that I will continue to demonstrate and continue the hunger strike that I started two days ago to prove to all our partners in the nation the lies of the regime about the presence of armed gangs, salafis and Muslim extremists intent on overthrowing the regime and exterminating the minorities. I advise the great people of Syria to continue their peaceful protests until the fall of the regime and they achieve the civil, democratic country that all Syrians dream of. I implore all Syrians to remain unified and stand together until the fall of the regime, the regime that has lost its legitimacy since the constitution was altered to accommodate Bashar Al Assad’s rise to the presidency for no reason other than the fact that he was the son of the previous president. I call on you today and every day to descend to every public square in civil disobedience and to go on hunger strike until the withdrawal of the army and security forces from every city and street and the release of all prisoners of conscience and political prisoners from the jails of oppression. I call on all honorable Syrians everywhere and I call on every human being wherever they are, to support us and to stand in front of our embassies all over the world and to declare their intent to go on hunger strike in solidarity with the right of all people to freely choose their own government without fear of losing their life. Oh free people of Damascus, free people of Barzeh and Quaboon and Midan, the free people of Douma and Kadam and Muadamieh and Harasta and Irbeen and Riknideen and Zabadani. Oh free people of Daraa and Baniyas and Latakia and Tartous. Oh free people of Hama and Aleppo and Idlib and Bukamal and Deir Elzor and Raqqah and Quamishli and Hasakeh. I call upon you to declare your civil disobedience and go on hunger strike in all public squares and streets in solidarity with the prisoners of the central prison of Homs who are themselves on hunger strike and to lift the siege off the neighborhood of Baba Amr that has been subjected to continuous shelling with heavy machine guns and artillery for the past week and that has been isolated from the world. No one knows what is going on inside Baba Amr. Baba Amr is being subjected to a real humanitarian disaster. Stand with them because no street, neighborhood or city in Syria is immune to what is happening in Baba Amr. As the Arab League continues to set one deadline after another, the regime continues to oppress the people of Syria, robbing them of their dignity, their freedom and their life.
And peace, all the peace for Syria and it people.
And peace, all the peace for Syria and it people.
And peace, all the peace for Syria and it people.
Thursday of the General Strike, Homs, 11/10/2011.”
(Translation: Abu Kareem)
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